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Juhani Hakala

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Juhani Hakala

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Keskustelua Dalai Laman kanssa 4

Keskustelua Dalai Laman kanssa 4                  20.1.12


DL: My hope and wish is that one day, formal education will pay attention to what I call “education of the heart.” Just as we take for granted the need to acquire proficiency in the basic academic subjects, I am hopeful that a time will come when we can take it for granted that children will learn, as part of the curriculum, the indispensability of inner values: love, compassion, justice, and forgiveness.

JH: That is also the reason why the evolution theory does not handle the spiritual development of the people, as You have written. In spiritual area the western world far is behind Asia. To us owning more and more things and career are far more important. The standard of living is far more important than the standard of life We have not learned how to be a human being; how we can respect and be grateful that we are in the state, where enlightment is possible.  It is possible if we know how to love each other, every people - not only our family or nation.


DL: In an increasingly interdependent world our own welfare and happiness depend on many other people. Other human beings have a right to peace and happiness that is equal to our own; therefore we have a responsibility to help those in need. Many of our world's problems and conflicts arise because we have lost sight of the basic humanity that binds us all together as a human family.

JH:We have delegated the humanity to the public organizations. Welfare state takes care of its citizens. We don’t help our neighbors, because we think that it is the task of the state. We can start learning the humanity by helping our neighbors and other suffering people. We have to take the responsibility back to us. People and nature need our help. In Christmas time we have also to buy in responsible way, in the way, which don’t destroy tha nature.


DL: We are all, by nature, clearly oriented toward the basic human values of love and compassion. We all prefer the love of others to their hatred. We all prefer others’ generosity to meanness. And who is there among us who does not prefer tolerance, respect and forgiveness of our failings to bigotry, disrespect, and resentment?

JH: There is always reason to bad behavior. Quite often the reason is in our childhood. We only do what we have learned to do. That’s why there are not bad people. If you understand that there are reason to their bad behavior, then you can love those people. The spiritual path begins with understanding these reasons and changing behavior.
And happiness is real, when we deal it with other people.


DL: We are all, by nature, clearly oriented toward the basic human values of love and compassion. We all prefer the love of others to their hatred. We all prefer others’ generosity to meanness. And who is there among us who does not prefer tolerance, respect and forgiveness of our failings to bigotry, disrespect, and resentment?

JH: The aim of every spiritual road is to find inside the energy/blessing of love and compassion. To dig it under all the personal trash. To find that common blessing/energy/mindfulness/primary wisdom etc. which we all have.


DL Compassion is something really worthwhile. It is not just a religious or spiritual subject, not a matter of ideology. It is not a luxury, it is a necessity.

JH: Compassion starts with compassion to yourself. If you need all love to yourself, there are not left love to others.


DL: The creation of a more peaceful and happier society has to begin from the level of the individual, and from there it can expand to one's family, to one's neighborhood, to one's community and so on.

Juhani Hakala That is true, but the most important improvements are made in the society level, which is group of individual people. We need very soon big changes in western economies, which main factor is constant growth on the cost of nature. Now western economies are in big difficulties, because there are no growth. It is possible also good growth in the green sector. The whole economic system is grounded the fact that to many people things are continuation of ego.

DL: There is a saying in Tibetan that “at the door of the miserable rich man sleeps the contented beggar.” The point of this saying is not that poverty is a virtue, but that happiness does not come from wealth, but from setting limits to one’s desires, and living within those limits with satisfaction.

On the certain level the things don’t bring more happiness. But in western world people think that only things bring happiness. Newer and newer things are part of our ego. And they are more and more sad, because newer things come all the time.  But in poor countries things bring happiness. If we consume less and give more money to the poor countries, so the happiness of the whole world increases. But in western countries  we need more and more things to keep up our big ego. Our whole economic system is grounded of the fact that we need more things, we need all the time more economic growth , not the spiritual growth. Spiritual growth don’t destroy the nature.